If you're reading this in English

[undyingking]

Interesting post in languagelog about a bumper sticker saying "If you can read this, thank a teacher. And if you're reading it in English, thank a soldier."

I won't reiterate the discussion there¹ -- but I wondered if anyone had seen this sentiment expressed in the UK, where it would make a lot more sense as a proposition, in relation to WWII². Has anyone in the UK seen or heard of the teachers' message being added to / hijacked in this way?

---

1 Except to say that I favour the "ill-thought-out generalized right-wing puffery" theory.
2 Of course one might argue that Battle of Britain aircrew, naval convoys, or Russians, were more to thank, but leave that for now.

Comments

[ar-gemlad.livejournal.com]

But I could read before I met any teachers....

[zengineer.livejournal.com]

Likewise. I was given a few pointers by my parents and then puzzled it out from Janet and John Ladybird books.

[undyingking.livejournal.com]

Mm, me too, I can thank my mum. Although she did later work as a teacher for a few years, so maybe that conts.

[zengineer.livejournal.com]

I always imagined that the Irish and Scottish spoke English due to invasions by English soldiers in the middle ages and that America and the Commonwealth spoke English due to Colonial soldiers displacing indigenous populations and enforcing European systems of government. A simplification of course and I don't think we would speak German if they had won WWII (they don't all speak English after all).

[undyingking.livejournal.com]

they don't all speak English after all

Ah, but of course they would have been far more fiendishly dictatorial in their triumph than we were.

[celestialweasel.livejournal.com]

But is there any evidence that they planned to do this? Surely not.

[undyingking.livejournal.com]

None that David Irving couldn't airily dismiss.

[mr-malk.livejournal.com]

Nope, never seen it before now. It does seem to be a variant on the "If [x] hadn't done [y], you/we/they would all be speaking [z] by now." motif, which I have heard fairly often in different contexts.

I sometimes wonder what we'd have ended up speaking if Drake hadn't defeated the Spanish Armada, Nelson hadn't triumphed at Trafalgar (one might add Wellington winning at Waterloo to that as well, if only because it alliterates well), and if the Germans had won either of the World Wars.

I further wonder whether it would be at least as accurate to suggest that if Harold had beaten William in 1066, we might actually be speaking English right now, rather than the bizarre Franco-Norman/Saxon hybrid that we have evolved since then!

Not only that, but if the Islamic advance into Spain hadn't been checked, and arguably middle-eastern expansionism diverted by the Crusades and the Mongol Invasion, maybe we'd all be speaking Arabic. Unless the Roman Empire had hung on, in which case it'd be Latin of course... unless Hannibal had won the Second Punic War... then we'd (Heaven forfend!) be speaking Welsh!!!

[bateleur.livejournal.com]

I further wonder whether it would be at least as accurate to suggest that if Harold had beaten William in 1066, we might actually be speaking English right now, rather than the bizarre Franco-Norman/Saxon hybrid that we have evolved since then!

And if one does take "English" to mean modern English then perhaps the soldiers we should be thanking are Harold's soldiers, for being bad at their jobs?

Still, if I ever decide to get a bumper sticker of this kind it's going to say:

"Oh hai! Can readz? Thank interwebchoobz!"

[mr-malk.livejournal.com]

Ha! I wondered if someone would pick me up on that! (I'd have been surprised if no one had actually).

You know... if you printed a batch of those bumper stickers, and advertised them online, I would be willing to bet that even in this economic climate, you would make a mint. Of course if you did, and someone subsequently hunted you down and killed you for it, pour discourager les autres* (as it were), I'd have only limited sympathy!

*It's not pretension! It's contextual irony, honest!

[undyingking.livejournal.com]

"If you're not reading this in homo erectus, thank a glacier."

And it would be an aurochs-backside sticker, I suppose.

[celestialweasel.livejournal.com]

Well, presuambly we would have been learning German as a second language rather than French, in the manner that Russian was the 2nd language in the Soviet bloc.

[undyingking.livejournal.com]

See my comment above about presumed fiendishness of the putative conquering regime. But yes, it would be a bit impractical.

[zenithed.livejournal.com]

So far as I know there was no attempt made to impose German as an official language on the Vichy government, which I'd imagine would be a closer model for a post-defeat UK than the forced Germanization of Eastern Europe.

Apologies if this was covered in the thread you link to, I've not had the chance to have a look at that yet. Anyway, no, I've not seen anything like this in the UK!

[undyingking.livejournal.com]

One would have to assume that they'd wait for the war to be over before implementing such a far-reaching administrative project, so they never got the chance to do it in France.

But yes, it does seem a wee bit fanciful -- unless they had the extreme Whorfian / Orwellian belief that an imposed language would have the power to tame the thought patterns of the conquered.

[mr-malk.livejournal.com]

I can see the likelihood of a new ruling elite insisting that all government documents are in their own language, and possibly that official business be conducted in it.

I think it was pretty recent (in the last 10 years) that Parliament abandoned the practice of writing new English laws on vellum, in Norman French. Can you imagine that? On vellum. In Norman French!!! That's what I love about this country, we have the best anachronisms (or we did before New Labour got into power anyway... I don't think it's even compulsory to practise archery on a Sunday nowadays)!

[zenithed.livejournal.com]

AFAIK the Nazis had a fair amount of respect for the British, both racially and culturally (in so far as they saw any difference between the two), and would have avoided war if it were possible to do so without impeding their plans for Eastern Europe.

I guess it would depend on how easily the UK fell under the yoke - if it was a well behaved satellite state then I suspect they would have been happy to leave it as such, but I'm certainly no expert and it's impossible to say how things might have gone if they had indefinite time and opportunity at their disposal.

Anyway, have you heard about this? A film coming out later this year with the tagline "In 1945 the Nazis went to the Moon. In 2018 they are coming back": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Sky

[thecesspit.livejournal.com]

I agree with this comment...

The comment kind of fails to see World War 2 in context apart from choosing 'winners' and 'losers'.

We should be thanking the Russian speaking soldiers who died on the East Front if you want to think of it like that. By the time the US started showing up with soldiers (rather than lend lease, equipment, naval and air help), the war was really about the Eastern front and the Germans and Italians were being pushed out of North Africa, the home islands had weathered the Blitz. In the Pacific it's a different story and the huge naval prescence the US had was started to have an effect much earlier.

[undyingking.livejournal.com]

Heh, see my note [2] above re Russians. Western under-appreciation of what happened on the Eastern Front is one of my pet peeves.

[thecesspit.livejournal.com]

I missed yer footnote :) I suspected you knew what I wrote anyways.

[undyingking.livejournal.com]

That sounds a must-see! -- excellent idea.

[mr-malk.livejournal.com]

Well, whomsoever we have to thank for it, it certainly isn't George Dubya, as this definitively proves (as if we needed further - if hilarious - evidence).

[onebyone.livejournal.com]

Tattoo it on the vehicle-owner's forehead and release them into downtown Harare.